Freakquel #12: God's Not Dead: In God We Trust (with Jake Atwood)

[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign. Hello, everyone, and welcome to Odd Trilogies with Logan and Andy. I'm Logan, so. [00:00:22] Speaker B: And I'm Andy Carr. [00:00:23] Speaker A: In Odd Odd Trilogies, we usually take a trio of films, whether taught by cast and crew thematic elements or just straight up numerical order. And we discussed the good, the bad and the weird surrounding each one of these films. However, Today is our second prequel of 2020. [00:00:37] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. [00:00:38] Speaker A: And it's one that I guess you could say we are blessed to have today because last year we covered a trilogy of sequels tied to an infamous Modern. Can't say classic, but I think a modern. [00:00:54] Speaker B: Certainly a modern staple. [00:00:55] Speaker A: A modern staple in a lot of ways for a lot of people. Probably for unironically, for Christian audiences, ironically for the intern and everyone else. [00:01:04] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:01:04] Speaker A: But we tackled last year the God's Not Dead sequels with, you know, the sequels to the 2014 film God's Not Dead. And it's God's Not Dead 2. God's Not Dead. A light and darkness. And I believe God's Not Dead. We the people. [00:01:18] Speaker B: We the people. That's right. [00:01:20] Speaker A: And we did that with our very good friend of the pod, as well as in real life, as well as just a humble servant of trash beloved Christian films, God's Not Dead. And also if you've been catching up this year of Garry Marshall holiday films, because you've also heard him earlier this year with that Jake Atwood. Jake, say hi. [00:01:41] Speaker C: Hey, thanks, guys. Happy to be on the pod again and sorry for the havoc that's been wrecked upon us once again. [00:01:48] Speaker A: Now, in case you haven't caught on yet, at the end of that sequels episode, I believe Andy finds an article that says there could possibly be a fifth God's Not Dead film. And not only a possible fifth film, but it might come out the same year we are doing the sequels episode. [00:02:06] Speaker B: Yeah, it was. Yeah, the report was, yeah, that it was set for last year, but there were no other details. [00:02:13] Speaker A: And lo and behold, last year in September, probably late September, early October, we get what wasn't meant to be an ominous text and picture from Jake. But we do get a picture of a Fathom Events poster for a little film that we are covering today called God's Not Dead in God We Trust, the fifth installment installment of the God's Not Dead franchise. You see, it took, you know, nearly three decades for Mission Impossible to get eight films. It took God's Not Dead 11 to get five films. [00:02:45] Speaker C: God's Good. [00:02:46] Speaker A: God is all the time. [00:02:47] Speaker C: All the time. [00:02:48] Speaker B: God is good. [00:02:50] Speaker A: That was disgusting how that felt like that just felt that I. I don't think I've ever felt as uncomfortable on the podcast. Is that working the way that it did? [00:03:01] Speaker B: Jake, I want to note right up here at the top that as we were starting the film that we're talking about today, you remarked that you're gonna have to maybe clean up your standard or your protocol for how you suggest films to watch and talk about. [00:03:21] Speaker C: I feel like I've just left an unequivocal stand stain on the pod. I feel like I'm peddling too much trash, but also like I'm keeping the. You know, I'm trying to keep the mission statement. I'm trying to find the odd, you know, really. You know, and odd doesn't necessarily mean good, you know. [00:03:36] Speaker B: Right. It's the best. You strike true when it comes to finding an odd trilogy, for sure. [00:03:40] Speaker A: You don't really think about it with friends until you have moments like this where you realize that you all love trash in certain ways. [00:03:47] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. [00:03:47] Speaker A: And there's just certain parts of trash because we have, like, you know, there's the Miami connections, the rooms of it all where we can all come together and just enjoy the shit out of that. But then there's other. There are pinpoints of different types of so Bad it's Good or just very controversial films. [00:04:03] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:04:03] Speaker A: That peak interest of other people in our group. More so than others. And years. I mean, you had a fascination more with the Garry Marshall films. And then with God's Not Dead, you're like, well, guys, at the time, I think you did it because you thought there were only three. [00:04:18] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. [00:04:19] Speaker A: Then I think we found out there were four. And then we're like, well, we just. We'll just do the sequel stuff. [00:04:23] Speaker B: Right. [00:04:23] Speaker C: And, like, don't get a little bit twisted. These movies have left the so Bad it's Good station, like. Oh, absolutely. So many entries ago. [00:04:32] Speaker A: I would argue that it basically left the station nearly fully after the first film. [00:04:37] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:04:37] Speaker A: And then two. Yeah, two has it a bit. But, like, I mean, again, if you haven't listened to that episode yet, we would highly recommend you do so because we are going to probably call. Call back to a lot of the trees. [00:04:50] Speaker B: You can't talk about the fifth God's. [00:04:51] Speaker C: Not Dead without talking about the other for the. The series so far. [00:04:56] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, as we kind of alluded to, the first film is like the iconic so bad it's good Christian movie. It's got kind of the most ludicrous payoffs and. And gotcha moments. Of like this is how we take down atheism and. And, you know, defend our faith. Yeah. And, and, and two quickly kind of drops into sort of run of the mill, like propaganda Y stuff. [00:05:24] Speaker A: Yes. [00:05:26] Speaker B: And then. Which. And it also introduces us to Ray Wise in these films. [00:05:32] Speaker A: Yes. [00:05:33] Speaker B: Which. Who makes a return in today's film. [00:05:36] Speaker A: As the most evil liberal slash Democrat. [00:05:39] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:05:39] Speaker A: To exist. [00:05:40] Speaker B: Right, yeah. [00:05:41] Speaker A: Which I feel like in the sense. [00:05:42] Speaker B: Which is to say the average liberal Democrat. [00:05:45] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. I mean, to sum it up, basically from the late 2000s there was a bit of a boom with low budget Christian films. I would probably say it was definitely before this. But like you have Facing the Giants in the late 2000s, you have Kirk Cameron's Fireproof in the same era. You have how to Save a Life. And the reason why I remember that film is because I did see that with my youth group at the time in theaters. [00:06:14] Speaker C: Same. [00:06:14] Speaker A: It is a film. It was basically this common run of these films that were low budget and always had a call to action text, so and so this and that. This is also like at the apex of almost popularity in a way where we have films like the. I guess the most modern version of the Shack with like Sam Worthington and Octavius Spencer. [00:06:37] Speaker B: Oh yeah. [00:06:38] Speaker A: Also there's a Jennifer. There's a Jennifer Gardner, I believe film. I think it's Jennifer Gardner where like her. Her daughter nearly dies and says she sees heaven. It's supposed to be based off a real story. [00:06:50] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:06:51] Speaker A: You know what I'm talking about. [00:06:52] Speaker B: God, what was that? [00:06:53] Speaker C: I could only imagine something like that. [00:06:54] Speaker A: There's also of course, the I can only imagine biopic of the lead singer that created that song or the. The act the singer created that song. But around the time that these films are basically going from like actual getting the fucking protagonist of the James Cameron Avatar films in a Christian film. [00:07:13] Speaker B: Right. [00:07:14] Speaker A: As we're coming down from that apex in 2014, we get a class. I would say at this point a classic modern Christian film with all the same, you know, shortcomings. C level, maybe even, I would argue D level casting. [00:07:30] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:07:30] Speaker A: As well as just the call to action. Duck Dynasty. The newsboys are like not even. Even the height of Goss did the song, but almost the second to third revival of that song. And when that film comes out, that film makes $60 million in. In the box office, but becomes infamous online for being a film that is the film, the original film. Hilariously consider where we're are now with the fifth film. The original film is literally about a Christian student going against his atheist professor. [00:08:03] Speaker B: Right. [00:08:04] Speaker A: About the existence of God. [00:08:05] Speaker B: Feels quaint now. [00:08:06] Speaker A: Quaint in comparison. Because now the series has become. In that first film, there is a pastor named Pastor Dave who is played by the main writer of this franchise, main producer of this franchise, and now the lead. I guess you could consider whatever a sex symbol is for pure flicks, but the. The sex symbol of pure Flix and like one of the heads of pure flicks. David A.R. white, who has been in every single one of these films. The films from I would say three onwards have been solely about him with side plots about other people. [00:08:42] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:08:43] Speaker A: Like smaller characters. The. The main character, Josh, from the first film does come back in three, but very minimal. [00:08:50] Speaker B: Iconic cameo. [00:08:52] Speaker A: Iconic cameo. But by the time we're at where we're at now with five, we get in four, which we talked about in the last. In the. In the episode. Is that four feels like the COVID film. Because it pretty much was. [00:09:06] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:09:07] Speaker A: And feels like the lowest budget of any of the sequels. And also feels like arguably the worst and the laziest of the sequels. [00:09:15] Speaker B: Yeah. Four kind of goes full tilt into that kind of banal propaganda y talking pointy stuff. [00:09:23] Speaker A: Because if I remember correctly. And it was just last year, which feels wild. It was just last year when we did this. But like, I believe we watched. Did we watch one and two together? And then we did three and four at a separate time together. [00:09:36] Speaker B: That sounds double features. [00:09:38] Speaker A: Because we. Because when we finished 2, we found out that the director of 2 Vanished Snow is the director of 4. [00:09:45] Speaker B: Right. [00:09:45] Speaker A: And ultimately ends up being the director of 5. [00:09:47] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:09:48] Speaker A: And so we thought, oh, this will be a fun time. Because two is batshit and silly and has like this. This. There's a fun aspect to it where it's like. [00:09:57] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:09:58] Speaker A: It's taking itself way too seriously. [00:10:00] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:10:01] Speaker A: And these films have always taken. Like. There's nothing about these films that scream. It's trying to get a. So bad. It's good audience. [00:10:07] Speaker B: Oh, no. [00:10:09] Speaker A: But like, we were like maybe four, because maybe four will bring it back to. I guess that's quote unquote roots after three kind of takes a. Takes a. Interesting. The most interesting changes in the whole series of, like, having actual flaws. [00:10:25] Speaker C: Yeah. Very empathetic turn. It's complex. The characters are. [00:10:29] Speaker B: Characters are challenged in, like a real foundational way. [00:10:33] Speaker A: A darkness. More so than just the title. A light and darkness. Actual darkness. Again, characters and flaws and actual death. [00:10:41] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:10:42] Speaker A: We lose a character that, like, we all three. I think even though we're not fans of these films. I think we genuinely kind of enjoyed a character that, like, passes away in the third film. And unfortunately we. He's sorely missed by the fifth. And we get kind of get to this point where four. We finish four and we're just like, if we couldn't be any more fucking done than we are now. Yeah, there's no way, like, how the fuck are they going to make more of these? And it's like, technically they could, but like, they would just be the laziest things because, yeah, his force. Whole thing is basically after having the third film be about Dave and almost like losing his church and having to rebuild and find his religion again to an extent. [00:11:29] Speaker B: Right. [00:11:29] Speaker A: Basically have to constantly be challenged because I don't know if most people know about this. Usually interesting stories have characters that are flawed and have constant challenges and arcs and whatnot. And Three had the most for Dave. Four basically goes, here's what the new thing with God's Not Dead sequels are. We're going to find a topic that conservatives or Christians probably find that we think our audience is going to find quite. Shouldn't be controversial, but is amongst the, quote, unquote, progressive left. And we're going to find Pastor Dave in his hole in St. Jude's and we're going to pluck him out of there and shove him into that problem and we're going to see if he. If he can solve it with God. [00:12:09] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:12:10] Speaker A: And so four is about homeschooling and about, you know, the government being too much into education. The government, it should be more of a states thing or more. We should trust the parents. [00:12:20] Speaker B: Right. [00:12:20] Speaker A: Because parents, you know, there's never been a parent in the existence of American history that has ever taken advantage of the system in a homeschool sense. [00:12:28] Speaker C: For sure. [00:12:29] Speaker A: And, you know, education has always been perfect and has way too much money and the teachers are clearly paid so well that they are just taking advantage of the children. You know, it's all these things that is like, yeah, this hilarious, you know, fantasy of what America is on the. On a certain level. [00:12:48] Speaker B: Yeah. It's the. The persecution complex to the nth degree. [00:12:52] Speaker A: And again, all these films have that. But Four just felt like it was drowning in the persecution. It was drowning in it all. All the way to, like the finale of Four, which we should start when we talk about five. Five starts basically recapping four in that. [00:13:10] Speaker B: Yeah. Honestly, kind of remixing the intro of. [00:13:13] Speaker A: Four again, which is weird, with four basically ending with, I guess, Dave and his team losing Their version of the battle and Dave still fighting for God and his version of like what God would want from the government and what states and church and whatnot. And then into five, we go into it being like, okay, how's Dave? What's Dave got himself into this. [00:13:41] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:13:41] Speaker A: If we're really just gonna pluck him and throw him into anything or at least what, you know, has the idea of like we could just put Pastor Dave in just a topic. [00:13:50] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:13:51] Speaker A: And let God steer the wheel. Like, what are we doing in five? It is about a conservative constituent who is running for senate in Arkansas. D. Yeah. And Ray Wise, who again is the most evil liberal slash Democrat to ever exist in the history of God's Not Dead's franchise, is going to win if, you know, they don't have someone else go against him. And Isaiah Washington's character, who was introduced in four as like a, I believe, a Congressman who supports, who's. Who believes in God and supports Pastor Dave, he was more in the shadows. And four being like, you're up against the ropes, Dave. You're never gonna win that type of person. Isaiah's character basically goes, you know who would be a good replacement for the man who just died? Pastor Dave. And St. Jude's yeah. And so we get a film where Pastor Dave, who is not a politician, doesn't want to be a politician, nor does he want to run to be a politician as being kind of forced into being almost the conservative choice, the Republican choice for Senate in Arkansas. [00:15:05] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:15:06] Speaker A: And so this becomes what apparently is a 98 minute. We kind of lost track of what, how long this movie was at a certain point, but a 98 minute film of Pastor Dave trying to find his way as not only a man of God, but also a man of the state. [00:15:25] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:15:25] Speaker A: A man of government. And as he shudders thinking of how horrible the government is. [00:15:31] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:15:31] Speaker A: And. [00:15:32] Speaker B: And all the while navigating the ever present debate of the separation of church and state. [00:15:40] Speaker A: Yeah. Which is a. Yeah. [00:15:42] Speaker C: Oh. [00:15:42] Speaker B: I mean, ultimately this film, the kind of ethos of it is, it's. It's an anti separation of church and state film because basically Pastor Dave is working on moving the United States more toward theocracy. That seems to be his, his goal. [00:16:01] Speaker A: Yeah. He. He believes to a degree. I mean, I wouldn't even say to a degree. I think pretty bluntly that any kind of program that is like a socialist program. [00:16:10] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:16:11] Speaker A: Or any kind of like universal health care, you know, Social Security, you know, finance, like aid, everything, anything that is all just supposed to Rack up the bill and not actually help actual Americans. [00:16:22] Speaker B: Yeah, right. [00:16:22] Speaker A: Apparently privatizing health care is the best option. And all these different things that like, you know, the film never really touches on. It's just, you know, Dave basically goes, but God. [00:16:34] Speaker C: Yeah. He's mostly championing the cause of this women's shelter that's through his church. But that's like casting the widest net over like all of the injustices that he's just, you know, like, standing up against. And like, I don't know, it just. It kind of just goes down the same road that a lot of these other God's a Dead movies are going. Where any, like, non believer character is either the most, like, antagonistic person imaginable or just so deeply shallow that it's like there's no. There's no, like, complexity at all. [00:17:07] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:17:08] Speaker A: Yeah. I think a big thing too is that we. We talked about this. We were watching this and we talked about this in the sequels. Conversation. When it came to four is like one of the biggest things that is a massive downgrade from 3 to 4 is that they either thought that they did everything they could with Pastor Dave character wise and three. So they just don't do it ever again. [00:17:30] Speaker B: Yeah. Let's not even try. [00:17:31] Speaker A: Or. Yeah. Or they were just like. I think Dave should just be like a figure that is just a conduit for God and has no character whatsoever. [00:17:40] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:17:41] Speaker A: Other than what would God do? Because. [00:17:43] Speaker B: Stagnant vessel. [00:17:44] Speaker A: Yeah. Because he. Similar to four, he does not have an arc. Other than. Is this the path God has put me on? [00:17:53] Speaker B: Right. [00:17:53] Speaker A: This is really what he wants from me. Yeah. Because again, it's one of those things where I. There. I don't know if we're having any listeners that really are like, like infuriate or frustrated that we have these, like, conversations with these films. But like, it's, I think in. In a sense of an objective, like an objectivity. There are filmmakers who make Christian films that do it in an interesting way. Now, can I think of any off the top of my head? No. Because when I think of modern Christian filmmaking, I think of like the fallback and the pitfall of just having main characters not really have any agency in the actual plot because they can close their eyes, pray to God everything will be okay. And that just like quote, unquote, real life, everything will be okay. And we don't have to have any kind of strife or stress or any kind of flaws. My flaws have been cleared. [00:18:47] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:18:47] Speaker A: My financial troubles have been cleared because I prayed and has, like, this very base level. Like, this only can go so far and it pretty much loses its luster and intro in, like, an interesting way, if it ever had in any interesting way. As soon as you just introduce that, that's what you're going to do. Yeah. And unfortunately with Dave from 4 onward, that is basically what he's given. And again, Dave in the first film is basically the C plot, if not the B plot. [00:19:16] Speaker C: Yeah. There's a lot going on in the first movie. [00:19:19] Speaker A: There's like 18 plots. It's almost like a Gary Marshall film. Exactly like, going on. And his whole plot is basically like being like, oh, God, why won't my rental car work? It's like, I can't. Why? Is this a reason? Is this a sign? [00:19:34] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:19:34] Speaker A: And then the second film is basically, he is. He becomes a jury member on the case. [00:19:40] Speaker B: Right. [00:19:40] Speaker A: And he gets kicked off because Ray Wise is like, I don't want a man of the cloth in the jury. And they like, kind of kick him out. I think he also has health troubles. I think he has, like, a heart thing. [00:19:51] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:19:53] Speaker C: Oh, yeah, he does. Because he gets pulled off. Yeah. Yeah. [00:19:56] Speaker A: And again, he's not. He is not B or C plot, I would say. I think he's farther down. And then three makes him the A plot. Yeah, it makes him. You. You get a brother introduced, you get family lore introduced, you get, like, you know, the most flawed, the most, you know, questions to his own, you know, humanity and faith that you've ever gotten from this character. [00:20:19] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:20:20] Speaker A: And then four, he's there. He, like, he's just brought in. [00:20:24] Speaker B: Yeah, He's. He's been in stasis. [00:20:27] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:20:27] Speaker B: Post three for sure. And honestly, pre three. [00:20:31] Speaker A: Yeah. I mean, he. He basically, like, instead of trying to, like, really commit to a Melissa Joan Hart, John Tucker must die, having, like, two actors, like, fully commit to their role and then just have Dave pop in every now and again. Four and five, I feel like, have actors and actresses who are, like, the plots that are given are, I think, less than even the bare minimum. [00:20:59] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:21:00] Speaker A: So every time they cut back to them, like, the big thing in, like, four, I think, has a big conversation about, like, you know, like, again, it's about, like, kids and, like, being. Am I a good enough mother? I think there's characters that are, like, questioning how they are as parents as well as, like, the education of it all and, like, trying to, you know, how do you balance being a mother and, like, a person of faith and, like, stuff like that where it's like, that has nothing. While Dave is a person of faith, he is not a mother. So that's like. You can't really add to that conversation. 2 5. Well, I said 25 has basically the only other really plot of the film, other than Dave running for Senate, is his campaign manager, who I believe is basically an agnostic. Is agnostic. Because I think in these films, if you're an atheist, you automatically burn up into flames. [00:21:59] Speaker C: Well, yeah, you're like, sympathetic version of that. That's just purely in opposition to any organized religion. [00:22:06] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:22:07] Speaker A: And her. She is, I guess, the. The emotional crux of the film because her whole thing ends up being. And this is something you don't find out until the very end of the film. You find out that there is. She had a relationship with the actor Scott Baio. It's. It's. He's. He is a character. [00:22:22] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:22:23] Speaker C: He's like the opposite party staffer. [00:22:25] Speaker A: Yeah, he' Wise's staffer. She had a relationship with Scott Baio's character. They basically fooled around. She got pregnant. He told her to get rid of it, and she kept the baby. And basically is like, I'm a fool. This guy took advantage of me in terms of, like, my professional status. I was basically burned from my campaign, yada, yada. This is all her story. Dave doesn't have any of this. [00:22:52] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:22:52] Speaker A: And so, like, this is all kind of being dumped onto him, which he is just like, whatever. Like. Because this whole thing in the film is, if it's not about. It's not about running for Senate, it's about a women's shelter that got shut down because it didn't have enough funding. Right. And clearly it didn't have enough funding because we're putting money in the wrong places. [00:23:11] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:23:11] Speaker A: Does Dave know which places are wrong? Not necessarily. Just a general. [00:23:15] Speaker B: How could he. [00:23:16] Speaker A: Wrong. Yeah. And so when you five, hilariously, I think, has the least amount of plot lines out of all the sequels. [00:23:24] Speaker B: Yeah. It's kind of just one. Basically, the. A plot. Yeah. [00:23:28] Speaker A: Because, like. [00:23:28] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:23:29] Speaker A: Even character arcs, even Isaiah Washington's character where her. Like, he's the one that brings Dave into the Senate race, and then he's gone for the majority of the. [00:23:36] Speaker C: He's like, in five scenes. [00:23:37] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:23:38] Speaker A: And he comes back and he goes, this country scares me. The people have lost faith in God. And, like, he's bringing the scene. He's bringing whatever. Whatever you consider sauce in the scene. [00:23:49] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:23:49] Speaker A: Like, really putting a lot of. He's putting a lot of mustard on this dog in this fucking Scene. [00:23:54] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:23:54] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:23:54] Speaker A: And it's like. It's like Jake said, it's like one of five scenes. And then his next scene is just him going and nodding his head as Dave wins the Senate race. [00:24:04] Speaker C: Yeah. Half of his scenes are him smiling at a TV screen about Pastor Dave. And he's. It's so. It's wild. [00:24:12] Speaker A: And he's a producer on the film. It is. It's Vance Null again, like we said, is the director of Two and Four is back in five. [00:24:21] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:24:23] Speaker A: The newsboys has a bigger role in this movie. [00:24:26] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:24:26] Speaker B: They're upgraded again. [00:24:28] Speaker A: They get a new song. Whether it was meant to be a film to promote that song in a sense or it's just like, oh, no, this song fits in work. Yeah. [00:24:37] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:24:37] Speaker A: Because apparently originally this film was supposed to be called Rise up and then get the last name change or whatever will be last name for this. In God We Trust. And it's one of those things where, like, we're watching this and we're just like. I think all we're having. We're having a good time as a watch party since. [00:24:55] Speaker B: Yeah. Socially we're enjoying ourselves. [00:24:57] Speaker A: Socially, we are like, at the height of the amount of people watching this film is five people. [00:25:02] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:25:03] Speaker C: And it's fine. [00:25:04] Speaker B: We're entertaining each other because the film cannot. [00:25:07] Speaker A: Yeah. And it's just like we're watching them. But I think there's a part of all three of us thinking about, like, when we're going to talk about this. We all ultimately have to come back to the point of. There is a line where this franchise could literally make a. A hundred more of these movies. And the other side of that line is, okay, I guess we're done. [00:25:26] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:25:27] Speaker A: Yeah. We just, like, are like, where the. [00:25:29] Speaker B: It's hard. [00:25:30] Speaker A: Does that line fully become a wall? [00:25:32] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:25:32] Speaker A: Where you stop it. [00:25:34] Speaker B: Especially coming off of Four and going into this. And unfortunately it being kind of like retreading through very similar tonal area and. And lack of creativity and terrible writing. It's hard to envision that, like, any further entries would do anything different. It kind of feels like we've. We're gonna be stuck in this mode if we make more Gods Not Dead movies and they're just gonna be continually kind of badly depositing on whatever the latest religious talking point is. [00:26:15] Speaker C: Like. Like, at this point, the formula is also just set with, like, you know, Pastor Dave is gonna be the main guy in this and he is, like, more emotionally counseling the characters around him and he is somehow in the center of these plots. [00:26:29] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:26:29] Speaker C: And he's just a vessel for God to talk about. All these points about Christianity and opposition of these characters that are never going to be more complex than, oh, you think anything. You know, it, like, it. It has become like it's kind of boiled down. What made the first one at least slightly interesting is that there was an actual debate class happening. There was a debate student, professor. And as much as that can be, like, cringy and, like, it's very campy, like, at least was trying to, like, have a discussion about something where now it's like you could write the script while watching the movie. [00:27:03] Speaker B: Yeah. Any. Any like, quote, unquote debate presented in this or even in four is, like, so rudimentary and, like, mechanical that it's like, why are we even pretending to have a conflict over this? Because it's clear that, you know, not only that the movie has its own answer and opinion on this matter, which is obvious, you know. Yeah. But that it has no interest in even, like, engaging with the other perspectives. [00:27:39] Speaker A: We should definitely tell the listeners that, like, when we were just about to start five, I basically said we should talk about what we think this movie will have in terms of, like, the amount of newsboys. Maybe, like, cameos. [00:27:53] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:27:54] Speaker C: Who's gonna come back. [00:27:55] Speaker A: Yeah. And you, Andy was like, I'm even gonna go farther than the generic. I think this is. That. I think this movie is gonna pull out this fucking line that I hear all the fucking time when it comes to this side of the argument. [00:28:07] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:28:08] Speaker A: And it's gonna come out like this. And I think it's gonna be verbatim. And when you said the line. And I want you to say. I don't want you to mean. You say the line. [00:28:16] Speaker B: Well, verbatim may be generous, but it's. It's the. The talking point is along the lines of the separation of church and state was not created to protect the state from the church. It was to protect the church from the state. And I was like, I have a feeling, just given the premise of this movie, that Pastor Dave's gonna say that. [00:28:38] Speaker A: Right. And I think when you said that, at least if probably Jake and I were both like, oh, and they've got to say. And I think Adam nearly threw open his mouth when he heard you say that. [00:28:46] Speaker C: And then Pastor Dave verbatim just says that in a debate. [00:28:50] Speaker A: And I thought it was gonna be a finale stinger. Like, it was a final debate. He was gonna say this. And then it was almost gonna be like mental points, like. Like, mental attack on Ray Wise. [00:29:02] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:29:02] Speaker A: Psychic Damage threw that light out 30 minutes in. [00:29:07] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:29:08] Speaker A: I'm like, that is so early on to have that like, kind of talking point. Well, it is wild. [00:29:13] Speaker B: Yeah. I guess it kind of serves as the like, oh, Dave's actually got a shot at this kind of moment. Like, oh, he's got an argument. [00:29:21] Speaker C: Yeah. And like, like again, like these earlier movies, I feel like had a lot more of these like, gotcha moments. Oh, for sure, you said that. Well, actually, yeah, the quote, you know, like the whole first movie is built around that where it's just like. [00:29:35] Speaker B: Right. [00:29:36] Speaker A: Like, what do you hate? [00:29:37] Speaker C: God doesn't exist. [00:29:39] Speaker B: You know, you hate something that doesn't exist. [00:29:41] Speaker C: Exactly. And so like, it's just kind of hard. Like it feels much lazier because it is even trying to give itself the opportunity for these like easily dunk moments. [00:29:51] Speaker B: Yeah. It's just. Yeah. It very much feels like it's going through the motions. [00:29:55] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:29:56] Speaker B: Even at its own very lazy and straightforward game. Like. [00:30:01] Speaker C: Right. [00:30:01] Speaker A: It. It fee. I mean, it's. Again, it's funny because you. We say like that and then I think there's a part of all of our brains where it's like, okay, well, pure flicks now. The first film came out, it wasn't a streaming service. Now Pure Flix has their own streaming service. [00:30:14] Speaker B: Right. [00:30:15] Speaker A: Why isn't this just a pure flicks original. Why at this point are you putting this original series or like original series or just like in like, like an original streaming. Like, you know how like, you know. [00:30:27] Speaker B: Well, I can tell you it's probably not for the purposes of mining that box office for precious gold. [00:30:33] Speaker A: No. But at the same time I was like, it's one of the reasons why I wanted to hold off on because Jake was going to look at the box office and I want to hold off because the thing is like we the people made about 1.1 million. [00:30:44] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:30:45] Speaker A: I assume that is a. [00:30:46] Speaker B: Is a loss on a 2 million budget. [00:30:48] Speaker A: Yeah. And In God We Trust made three times that. Yeah, wildly enough. And again, it's. To say that I'm surprised would be a lie because again with how the election cycle is going last year. [00:31:01] Speaker C: Yeah. It was really September and election year. So that's going to juice the numbers. [00:31:05] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:31:06] Speaker A: If you're telling. If you're saying that there are some people out there who would rather go see and God like a God We Trust than the Apprentice. I would be not. I'd be like, yeah, of course. Like it's. You're going to get people who are just Going to go for the popcorn, schlock, candy stuff. [00:31:20] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:31:20] Speaker A: And yeah, it's just one of those things where watching this, it's like. And looking at how it made three times the budget that Ford did, even though it literally does the same shit that 4 does and being like, I mean, fucking. I guess that's enough then, right, For a six. I guess you could do another one. I mean. And that's when. That's where. [00:31:39] Speaker B: Because that is five is the first one since the first film to like tick up on the box office. [00:31:48] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:31:48] Speaker B: Because I think because 2, 3 and 4 are all continual down downturns. [00:31:54] Speaker A: Because it's like 60 for 1, around. [00:31:57] Speaker B: What, 10 to 15 for 2, 64 for 1, 25 for 2, 7 for 3 and 1 for 4. [00:32:07] Speaker A: Yeah. So again, it's not like. [00:32:09] Speaker B: And then back up to three for. [00:32:10] Speaker A: Yeah, it's, it's. [00:32:11] Speaker C: It's. [00:32:11] Speaker A: It is a is. I guess that's where you would. That's where you put the picture of Jeb Bush winning, where it's like, there's a chance. Yeah. Please clap because we made 3 million instead of 1 this time. [00:32:23] Speaker B: Yeah, it's just. [00:32:24] Speaker A: It is kind of just watching this and be like, do I hate this more than 4? And in my opinion, no. But what. [00:32:32] Speaker B: I. I don't hate it any more or less. [00:32:35] Speaker C: I don't know. I feel like. I guess. [00:32:38] Speaker A: Do you know? [00:32:39] Speaker C: Well, recency bias is definitely affecting me, but. Because right now at this moment I'm struggling to remember, like, any big scenes from four, but, like, I know that this movie will wash away, like, with the same speed as the fourth one. So. Yeah, they are so comparable. And also. Yeah, it's like to your point, like, I don't know where you take this from. He's a congressperson now, so you can engage with any issue you want to, but like, like, clearly they're not going to try to like, comment it from a nuanced perspective. [00:33:07] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:33:07] Speaker C: Like is related to anything like, actually happening in real politics. [00:33:11] Speaker A: Because I would argue the most insane. [00:33:13] Speaker B: Number six gonna be Dave the Politician getting canceled. [00:33:18] Speaker A: Oh. [00:33:18] Speaker B: Over some. [00:33:19] Speaker A: They do bring up a lot about being. [00:33:21] Speaker B: They kind of mention it a few times. [00:33:23] Speaker A: And again, the talk, the conversation about the separation church and state feels a. [00:33:26] Speaker B: Little late for a cancel culture movie. [00:33:29] Speaker C: But January six, that the pitch God's Not Dead. [00:33:34] Speaker B: Insurrection Day. [00:33:35] Speaker C: Oh, my God. Yeah. [00:33:36] Speaker A: Gosh. Or like I said, like, because we. My roommate, one of my roommates Ray, said that they saw newsboys that are six Six Flags on Christian. [00:33:48] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:33:48] Speaker A: Is. Is six God's not dead. Six colon. Flags. Let's see. Flags on Christian Day, Senator. [00:33:56] Speaker B: Sponsored by Six Flags. [00:33:59] Speaker A: Yeah. I mean, again, it's like the most, I would say, genuinely insidious thing about these sequels, and especially the movies is like, they toe the line. Well, enough of being like, well, Dave is fighting for God. [00:34:15] Speaker B: Right. [00:34:15] Speaker A: I mean, and he also just doesn't know anything. Like, it's like, oh, in these debates, he doesn't have any defense, really, other than you're just trying to take God out of the conversation. [00:34:24] Speaker C: Doesn't want to be a politician. He doesn't want to go low. He just wants to speak his message. And the movie itself is like. Like just constantly in conflict with that, where it's like, well, we need you to do something to move this plot forward. [00:34:39] Speaker B: Well, and it's kind of funny, too, because it's like, even from a meta perspective, it's like, okay, you have this Pastor Dave character who is kind of posited as this sort of conceptually apolitical. You know, like you said, he's fighting for his faith. He's, you know, spreading the word of God. He's not interested in playing the politics game. But the movie itself and the creators of the movie clearly want him to be that. To be that bastion for the political talking points and things. So it's like, okay, you're really heated. [00:35:14] Speaker C: That he starts going on his, like, intense speeches. [00:35:17] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:35:17] Speaker C: When he's pushed up against the wall. [00:35:19] Speaker B: Yeah. Your movie is kind of contradicting itself in having the conflict be, oh, well, Pastor Dave is above all this. But also the climactic turning points. Are Pastor Dave doing this. [00:35:32] Speaker A: Yeah. Because again, it's like, yeah. Him becoming a politician at the end of this is like, in another. In another sense, like, in another world, it would be like, almost like, well, now I'm kind of even more. I'm now interested because it's like it's a man of the cloth in a corrupt political system. But it's like the entire film that should be like, oh, my gosh, this is Pastor Dave as a politician. And his whole thing is, I really have no strong opinions on anything other than, like, God should be important. This is a Christian country. [00:36:05] Speaker B: Until. Until he's on a televised debate, and then suddenly his talking points are the. The debt and. And health care. Yeah. [00:36:13] Speaker A: And I'm in. [00:36:14] Speaker B: Big government's bad. [00:36:15] Speaker A: He basically says, I don. I don't like universal health care because it would rack up the debt, but doesn't outright say that he is for privatized. [00:36:25] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:36:25] Speaker A: Even though he clearly is. If you're not for univers, it's like. [00:36:28] Speaker B: Well, and I don't know if you guys have noticed this, maybe I don't think we talked about it on the. The sequels episode, but like the political parties have remained anonymous. [00:36:38] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:36:39] Speaker B: You know, Ray Wise is not a Democrat in. In words. Pastor Dave is not a Republican in words. [00:36:47] Speaker A: And they clearly know. [00:36:48] Speaker B: But you know, he's going on My Huckabee's show and he's, you know, talking the talking points and all that. [00:36:54] Speaker C: Duck dynasties when they're Duck Dynasty. Yeah. So, like, there's always these like, cultural things where it's like. Yeah, but it's like these movies assume this is this party. This is this party. [00:37:02] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:37:03] Speaker C: And I understand why they're not like stating outright. I also understand why they didn't like bring actual politics into it because they don't want to talk about the actual president whenever it's connected to this. But also it leaves it nowhere really to go now from like, like. [00:37:16] Speaker B: Well, and it leaves it detached kind of from reality. [00:37:19] Speaker C: Exactly. [00:37:19] Speaker B: It's like, okay, we're taking this squeaky clean vision of a divided America. [00:37:24] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:37:24] Speaker B: Without talking about the divisions in the room. [00:37:27] Speaker A: It has the energy where they almost are like, you know what? There's probably a demographic. There's a sliver of our demographic that doesn't want us to just go full, like Trump politics. [00:37:38] Speaker B: Keep your politics out of My God's not dead. [00:37:41] Speaker A: Because I thought of it too. Because, like, I thought watching this. There's a. [00:37:44] Speaker B: God's not woke. [00:37:45] Speaker A: There's a part where like, again, they. The film does the laziest version of like how Dave, you know, gets better in the polls, where they just do a montage of him shaking hands and just like kissing. [00:37:57] Speaker B: That's hilarious. The. The film does not bother whatsoever to. [00:38:01] Speaker A: He goes from. [00:38:02] Speaker B: Explain how Pastor Dave turns his campaign around. They just go to a 90 second montage set to music as his numbers go up from. [00:38:11] Speaker A: Ray Wise has like a 69% role and he has 31. [00:38:16] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:38:17] Speaker A: And then it goes to like 49 to 50. [00:38:19] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. [00:38:20] Speaker A: Almost like neck to neck. But in. There's one scene where they show. Where they show like where the, like the percentages are in the montage. They clearly put Dave in blue and Kane in red. Almost in a way to be like, see? [00:38:33] Speaker B: Yeah. See this? [00:38:35] Speaker A: We're not making him be a. Even though if you watch two, it's pretty fucking clear what he's. So it's like, it's really interesting. It's really insidious in that way where it's just like you, you are clearly just trying to not commit. Even though at this point the people who are probably fans of your stuff. [00:38:55] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:38:55] Speaker A: Are people that are like fully committed and like these things that you're talking about need to not stop talking. They are, they, the liberals are trying to kill God. [00:39:03] Speaker C: Right? [00:39:04] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:39:05] Speaker C: And not to be a conspiracy theorist because like you, the end of this movie ends like a lot of the gods that dead movies with a call to action of saying like 40 million Christians don't vote. 15 million aren't even registered. And it's saying like, make your voice, your vote matter. I will say the vote. It flashes red and then it turns orange. [00:39:26] Speaker B: That's really. [00:39:27] Speaker C: Maybe there's something there. Also that movie, that fun, something some. [00:39:30] Speaker B: Subliminal messaging movie came out. I didn't even notice that movie came. [00:39:34] Speaker A: Out in the fall. You know what else happened in the fall? Slash, winter. That's right. The Apprentice starring Sebastian Stan. Like, nothing else. Nothing else happened in. Especially November. But. Just kidding. The Pula Paranoia trilogy in November. [00:39:49] Speaker B: But that must have been what they were referencing. Yeah. [00:39:51] Speaker A: No. Yeah, it just, it just is funny because it's like in my head I was thinking the joke could be the sixth film is Dave taking on immigration. The seventh film. [00:40:03] Speaker C: Oh my God. [00:40:04] Speaker A: Being like the government keeps getting into our bathrooms and stuff like that. But the thing is like that would imply that Dave has any strong feelings about anything. [00:40:12] Speaker C: Would it be pro immigration? I'm trying to think of like the, you know, your neighbors. [00:40:17] Speaker B: Well, you would think he'd be pro health care. [00:40:23] Speaker A: Dave feels like he is the poster child and mascot for a low energy Christian. [00:40:28] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. [00:40:30] Speaker A: It's like Dave is not inherently an evil character or a mean person or trying to say that the other side is inherently evil. Which is why when Ray Wise is trying to like basically bait him into being mean to him. Never is. [00:40:47] Speaker B: Yeah. He's never malicious. [00:40:49] Speaker A: Yeah. But Dave also, like, it's. It's why three stands out the most, is he has the most agency and the most agency. [00:40:56] Speaker B: He falters. [00:40:57] Speaker A: Yeah, he falters. The most energy that Dave has is when he shakes that college student when he finds out he burnt the church. And then he feels bad immediately. [00:41:06] Speaker B: Right, right. [00:41:06] Speaker A: And so it's like, you can have Dave, you can have, I guess another 18 films about him being a fucking senator. But like, what is it gonna be when he really is this? Like, if you talk about immigration, he goes, well, I would just go with what God wants. [00:41:21] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:41:22] Speaker A: It's like, you know, you have to, you have to choose, right? [00:41:25] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:41:26] Speaker A: Like, because again, it's like you think of like, what a. Like in a classic sense, in a film, when it comes to like, you know, a politician who is like, promises a lot of things, then just goes, I'm just kidding, I'm going to go with my party. Fuck you. I'm not going to do what I said I was going to. [00:41:39] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:41:40] Speaker A: Or I'm just going to do the things that I said I wasn't going to be that hard on. And then it just goes entirely hard in the paint on those aspects. And to have Pastor Dave, who is clearly the most in the middle, milquetoast, lukewarm, like, I'm just a politician because you put me here. And it's like what a six could be. Especially consider five, While I do think where four kind of like, implies that, you know, this is what five could be having more. This conversation. The conversation in five about church and state is so general. [00:42:13] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:42:14] Speaker A: How much more general can you get in the sixth one if you're gonna be more like, yeah, like, are we. [00:42:19] Speaker B: Gonna continue down this path of let's have political discussions be more central to the story and be even more broad about how we tackle it? Like, you're just getting grayer and grayer. Not morally grayer, just like blander and blander. [00:42:38] Speaker A: You can't even go like, Dave is a libertarian. Like, that would imply even stronger values than. Dave has no real strong political views other than every time you bring up. [00:42:50] Speaker B: God, trust God, bring people to God. [00:42:53] Speaker C: At his best, when he is the figurehead of a church, a representative of a building and a place and a service. And the third movie is the, the most interesting thing that we can do with him because it's, it's that building being taken away from him. [00:43:07] Speaker B: Right. [00:43:08] Speaker C: And that, like, that's interesting, that's compelling. And now it's like he is really bumbling through whatever like, set of political, like, you know, hoops that the movie sets out for him. But, like, he's never like, engaged or interested. Like a version of this movie where he was actually moat. Like, it seems like he's motivated to this because it's like his calling, you know, he's like, driven to it because he's like, this is what he believed God is telling him that he wants him to do. And so then there's nothing that he can even really say with conviction. [00:43:38] Speaker A: I just remembered something before that we all completely forgot it's like, in four, one of the plot lines that are there. Because I was thinking, like, even in five, you don't get, like, the stuff in one that, like, made us just go crazy where it's like, you know, the A plot is, you know what? My teacher's being rude. I'm gonna prove to him that God is real. And then the D plot is a Muslim father finding out that his Muslim daughter is actually a Christian and just beats the shit out of her and throws her out. [00:44:06] Speaker B: Jesus. [00:44:06] Speaker A: Yeah. At least in four, I guess in four, they bring that father daughter dynamic back and I guess give some resolution to that. Which is hilarious to think now. And also, Martin comes back, right? A character that we cannot discern how. [00:44:24] Speaker C: Old that man is, but 20, 30, 40 or 50. [00:44:26] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:44:27] Speaker B: Somewhere in there. [00:44:28] Speaker A: But I can honestly say that he should be dressed better. Which, thankfully, at the end of this film, when he becomes the pastor, they. [00:44:34] Speaker B: Finally give him some decent duds. [00:44:35] Speaker A: Though his lapels are a little off, as Andy pointed out when we were watching. [00:44:39] Speaker C: But he lost the sweater vest, so he did improvement. [00:44:42] Speaker A: But, like, even his plot line, I believe in two was two or three or something was like, when his dad comes back, when his dad comes from China to confront him about. [00:44:52] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:44:53] Speaker A: He also beats his son. Like, every character that isn't white in the series almost has, like, a flip a coin. Is your dad going to beat you or not? [00:45:02] Speaker C: Right. [00:45:02] Speaker A: And then you, like, get the five, and it's like. [00:45:04] Speaker B: Well, because all the other cultures are violent savages. You know, like, never say it, but Dave's not gonna go there. Yeah. [00:45:12] Speaker A: God will lead us on the path, right? Yeah. Dave wins this Senate race basically because he remembers the Pledge of Allegiance and just says, you have a vote. That's like, all he does. [00:45:23] Speaker C: That's all he needed. [00:45:24] Speaker A: Yeah. Basically, he stumps Ray Wise by going, finish. What were you about to say? One nation under God. [00:45:33] Speaker B: Yeah. That's basically what it is. [00:45:34] Speaker A: And then goes, hey, guess what? This man wants to take your vote away. You have a vote. You know, a woman with fake baby that's hated me this whole movie. You have a vote. [00:45:42] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:45:43] Speaker A: Guy who's in a not Uber, who's been a running gag this entire series. You're now part of my congregation. You can vote. [00:45:50] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:45:50] Speaker A: Vote matters. And, like, that's the only reason why he wins. And it's the most basic, like, hilariously boring. Like, it's just. This is really what's gonna get him the election is just saying. [00:46:02] Speaker C: Yeah. It's just so lazy at this point, because, like, say what you want about the first movie, but you could tell that it was written with some intent and it was trying not to be controversial. But at least like, you know, have like this, like, I don't know, like, like expose, like do all these different viewpoints and bring them all under the, the umbrella of like the news boys at the end. [00:46:24] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:46:24] Speaker C: And like we've just went so far away from that, like, squeaky clean, folksy feeling at the end of these where it's like, well, hey, at least our corner of the world. We're all safe and good like it. [00:46:36] Speaker B: And now it feels like a Fox News broadcast. [00:46:38] Speaker C: Yeah, exactly. [00:46:40] Speaker A: Because they know. Because like at a certain degree of like you can get away with in that first two films. Like, the first film has the Duck Dynasty family and newsboys. And then the second film has the daughter of the, like the guy that one of the, like the youngest Duck Dynasty. [00:46:56] Speaker C: She had like done ministry things. She's pulled into it. [00:47:00] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:47:00] Speaker A: And the newsboys in those. But it's like, like at this point now, who are you gonna pull into these films? Joe Rogan? Ben Shapiro. [00:47:07] Speaker C: Yeah. Mike Huckabee is the answer. Bringing my cock. [00:47:12] Speaker A: You can't even bring Ted Cruz into it because at this point it's like most people who probably like these movies probably hate Ted Cruz. [00:47:19] Speaker B: Yeah. And I don't even think you can get as far as Ben Shapiro because he's too fiery. [00:47:25] Speaker C: Yep. [00:47:26] Speaker B: You know, he's too opinionated. Yeah. You know, sharp edged and too busy. [00:47:31] Speaker A: Trying to make lady ballers too. [00:47:33] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. Pure flicks is like three. [00:47:36] Speaker C: Then we'll cover on the pod. [00:47:38] Speaker A: No, we will. [00:47:38] Speaker C: That's a guarantee I make. [00:47:39] Speaker A: No, the guarantee is we're not going to cover a Daily Wire original. [00:47:44] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. [00:47:45] Speaker A: Oh, my gosh, that almost made me shiver as much as all of a sudden God is Good in unison. Daily Wire original. [00:47:54] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:47:54] Speaker B: The Daily Wire trilogy. Can you imagine it? [00:47:57] Speaker C: There's just such like, you know, in the first movie came out. When was that? [00:48:00] Speaker B: Was that 2014? [00:48:02] Speaker C: Yeah. So we've had nearly a decade with. There's over a decade with this franchise. And it's like every two years almost. [00:48:10] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. [00:48:11] Speaker C: Like there's just way less people culturally that are like Christian figures they can bring into this just because they need to keep detaching themselves from the reality they're trying to like, you know, present. [00:48:22] Speaker B: Right. [00:48:22] Speaker A: And I think they try to attempt, at least in this one, more so than four. I guess that the, the absence of having those Figures is the reason why Dave needs to win. Because we are losing those figures in their head in, like, the. The prosecuting, like, you know, the prosecution kind of mindset. And it is really just like, oh, my Lord, like, when this movie ended and we all were just like, ah, the news boys. Thank God they're getting us out of here. And just like every plot point, you think how it would go would just go that way. Like, it really is just like. Because I. I don't know where you two were in terms of. When did you kind of think in your head like, oh, Dave's hat. Dave has to win. Like, there's no way they're gonna make him go through, like, immediately. Did you think, like, when we were like, he's gonna win? [00:49:10] Speaker B: I think when they did the montage, the 92nd montage of him turning the numbers around, I was kind of like, they're not just gonna, like, roll over and have him. [00:49:19] Speaker C: Yeah. There's no compelling version of this for them where, like, Ray was wise, wins in the end. [00:49:24] Speaker A: I probably was the last person of the three of us to think that, only because I had to remind myself that technically he lost in four. So I was like, okay, he lost in four. So I think at this point they're not gonna have him lose again. [00:49:35] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:49:37] Speaker A: And again, the way. The way they give him the race is literally like. The way they describe is like, it's one in a million, a wild thing. He actually wins it. [00:49:45] Speaker C: Right. [00:49:46] Speaker A: And it's just fascinating that it is, you know, 20, 25. And we are still talking like, these movies are still coming out. [00:49:56] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:49:57] Speaker A: And they are. They have now they've gone from making 60 million and being like a cult. Like having a cult following at the box office for a while to being fathom events that we only hear about just in passing. [00:50:12] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. [00:50:14] Speaker A: Just a random poster in an AMC that we all go to and be like, wait, what the fuck? [00:50:19] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:50:19] Speaker C: And I think these movies have cont. Continued to, like, you know, they're not reaching outside their core demographic. [00:50:25] Speaker A: No. [00:50:25] Speaker C: You know, they, like, are not really interested in, like, adding nuance to discussion or, like, at least in the first couple films where they had, like, some interfaith discussions. You know, like, it really is set on its, like, demographic, and it really doesn't, like, get outside of that, like, echo chamber at all. It really is for a very specific audience. [00:50:45] Speaker A: And again, it's one of those situations too, where we even talk. Talked about it in the sequels episode. But we're at a point now we're like, well, these types of films seem like they are, you know, they have their niche and they just make just whatever they would like to make, and then they go off and do their own thing. We have, like, a resurgence almost in popularity in Christian media to an extent with, like, the Chosen. [00:51:05] Speaker B: Right? [00:51:05] Speaker A: The fact, like, literally, I think this year they had at the same, like, I think when I was looking like a few weeks ago, they had like, two separate theater showings for the Last Supper episodes of the Chosen, Part one in Part two. And like, it's like, yeah, the Chosen's like, it's season five, season six. And it's a show that it seems like it has been rock solid and has been the Christian show that has pulled people who have been, like, uncomfortable with Christian media kind of being stagnant and being like, you know what? Like, I mean, again, I remember, like, my aunt and uncle basically coming to me almost like, Logan, I. I think you're not going to believe this, but there's. We love the Chosen and I think you would like the cinematography on this Christian show. And I was like, what are you talking about? What is the show you speak of? And it's very sweet of them. And also, as we're talking too, and I. This might date the episode a little bit for some people out there, but like, this, the upcoming weekend, we have another interpretation of the Jesus story, right. That is fully animated. [00:52:05] Speaker C: That is apparently like, Isaac starring. Yeah. [00:52:08] Speaker B: What? He's an Oscar Isaac. [00:52:10] Speaker C: Is he the voice or are we talking about the animated Easter movie that's coming up? Yeah. [00:52:15] Speaker B: Oscar Isaac's in that? [00:52:16] Speaker C: Yeah, he's Jesus. [00:52:17] Speaker A: Oh, my Lord. [00:52:18] Speaker B: I didn't realize he was in that. [00:52:19] Speaker A: We gotta look up this castle. [00:52:20] Speaker C: I saw a trailer today that's crazy. [00:52:22] Speaker A: Because I've only been seeing more of it because we have. We have, you know, kind of like journal like, you know, critics that. We have friends that have seen it already. And I think was it like Evan even said, like, oh, this is actually pretty solid. [00:52:36] Speaker B: Yeah. He was like, it's fine. [00:52:38] Speaker A: Holy. Oh, my God. [00:52:39] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:52:39] Speaker A: Oscar Isaac as Jesus. Pierce Brosnan as Pontius Pilate. Kenneth Branagh as Charles Dickens. Hold on. What? [00:52:47] Speaker B: Yeah, I knew about Kenneth Branagh. [00:52:49] Speaker A: Mark Hamill as King Herod. Ben Kingsley, Forest Whitaker, Jim Cummings. [00:52:53] Speaker C: What a cast. [00:52:54] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:52:56] Speaker A: The guy who did the visual effects for Joint Security Area is the director of this movie. [00:53:03] Speaker C: Okay. [00:53:04] Speaker A: That is a Park Chan Wook film that I watched earlier this year. I just didn't realize the guy who did the visual effects of that movie was Making a great animated. [00:53:12] Speaker C: So yeah, maybe, maybe faith based films are having a comeback. [00:53:16] Speaker A: I mean it's again as long. It's almost like to a degree it has kind of like that. It's very similar to how Christmas movies can be at times where it's like as long as there is something that is Easter related or religious in the Easter time frame that they can just. Yeah. Throw it out. That's actually wild because like Oscar Isaac is in the Nativity story and now I'm just like, is there an Oscar Isaac Christian trilogy? I'm not even thinking about that. But yeah, I mean it just. Yeah, it kind of just shows us we're talking about this where it's like, you know, we are aware that what we are talking about in terms of the God's Not Dead franchise is not the whole of what Christian media is now. So it's like even like the cultural conversation, it's just, it is just wild to think that at the same time that all these like, you know, seems like genuinely positive reviews and good things that are coming out that are very religious and are not. Are unabashed about it, with a lot of talent behind it also have to just be like, well, since it's Christian, it's in the same genre as the Pastor Dave films. [00:54:19] Speaker C: Right. [00:54:20] Speaker B: It's almost like we don't need this grifty and anymore because there are other ways to make faith based films. [00:54:26] Speaker C: Well, these God's Not Dead movies like still have to carry on that this is like a debate, you know, like these are movies that are frame around debate when it seems like they're so uninterested in any sort of like, like at this point. [00:54:39] Speaker B: Engagement. Yeah. [00:54:40] Speaker A: Yeah. I mean it's. Yeah. Let's. What's. What's Darren Arowski up to? Do you want to make Noah two? He said they like that one. What else? [00:54:48] Speaker B: Noah two. [00:54:50] Speaker A: He's back. [00:54:51] Speaker B: Well, Sam Mendes is making those Beatles movies. I guess that's faith based. [00:54:55] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:54:56] Speaker B: I don't know. He's doing the Gospels. [00:54:59] Speaker C: It's just like, you know, it's just funny to think that like. And again the first movie is not like, I'm not even trying to like sing the praise of the first movie. [00:55:07] Speaker A: The Father Son of the John. [00:55:10] Speaker C: It's just that like none of like the complexity of all these just like, like it's, it's kind of where it's like. Yeah, I mean I understand why they would want to make a retelling of a biblical story versus this. This is way harder to Try to find something that's interesting and, like, going to, like, you know, expose their point of view, but it's. It's not even there in the movies, like, you know, since, like, the third one. [00:55:34] Speaker A: Yeah, it really. It. I feel like if the. If you have, like, the kind of the scale and like, one side is, I guess, a recent example of, like, having Netflix spending, like, nearly $300 million on, like, the Electric State and being like, you're putting so much money into this and you're expecting it to, like, do well. You're not putting this in theaters also, like, what the fuck is this? Why is this, like, treated as, like, such a big, you know, monumentous event, but it's coming out the same time as, like, the Life list for you guys? Like, where's. Why is this on streaming when it feels like you want to push it more as a theater film and then you find out it's because there seems like, you know, maybe it's not the best film in the world. And on the other side, you have, like, this film where it's like, why isn't this just on a pure flicks original streaming site? And why is this. Yeah, there's like, Yeah, I guess you get $3.3 million in a box office, but, like, this, there's no. You're not getting anything worldwide from this. And you're like, you know, it comes out and it goes away. And, hey, if it's just because they want to get easy money out of it and they know they'll get it through, like, a fathom event. [00:56:38] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:56:39] Speaker A: Maybe this was a pure Flix original to a degree. I wouldn't know. I don't have pure flicks. None of us do. But, like. [00:56:45] Speaker B: Right. [00:56:46] Speaker A: It is just interesting to see, like, that conversation of, like, having so many things about, like, you know, how hard it is to make movies and put them in theaters now and then this movie has, like, a theatrical release. [00:56:57] Speaker C: Right. [00:56:58] Speaker A: $3 million. When it's like, yeah, this could have just been streaming and probably been fine. [00:57:04] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:57:05] Speaker A: Yeah. I mean, that's God's Not Dead and God We Trust anything. Any final thoughts, boys? What do you think the sixth film will be called? Because we got we the people, we got in God We Trust. [00:57:15] Speaker B: I don't know. We were throwing out some fun names before we started recording Insurrection Day. [00:57:20] Speaker A: Insurrection Day Under God. One Nation. [00:57:24] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:57:25] Speaker A: Like, maybe One Nation without. [00:57:26] Speaker C: Yeah, we run out of American phrase. [00:57:29] Speaker B: Yeah, God's not Dead. Pledge Allegiance, Indivisible. [00:57:34] Speaker A: God's not dead. 6. [00:57:35] Speaker C: Yeah, they should start God's not dead. 6. God's not dead. Fight back. And just have like the, the. The attempted assassination. Donald Trump really just get the audience going. [00:57:47] Speaker B: There's an attempt on Pastor Dave's life. [00:57:49] Speaker C: There we go. That's the movie. [00:57:51] Speaker B: Yeah. The bullet. [00:57:52] Speaker C: God saved him. [00:57:53] Speaker B: The bullet nicks his cheek, right? Yeah. He raises a fist. [00:57:59] Speaker A: They just like, we get to like, God's not dead. 9. And they just call it Pastor Dave's Revenge. And there's like nothing. No thriller aspect. [00:58:07] Speaker C: I mean, it's funny you mentioned that, Logan, because I was looking up other David A.R. white movies and apparently he is in a thriller called Beckman where he is a former contract killer, newly spiritual. So we got an angle. But he has to save his adopted daughter when she's kidnapped by a deranged cult leader. [00:58:28] Speaker A: So we should do a double feature with that and the Fuse. [00:58:31] Speaker C: The Fuse. The. The franchises. [00:58:33] Speaker B: Yeah, well, and he has his. He also has his Mad Max ripoff series, Revelation Road. [00:58:42] Speaker A: It's a pure flicks. Apocalypse trilogy. [00:58:44] Speaker B: I think there's. Yeah, I think there's three of them. [00:58:45] Speaker C: Incredible. [00:58:46] Speaker A: That is one I think we talked about. Yeah, we could do that. [00:58:50] Speaker B: Well, Jake, if your thirst for dog ever returns to you, you're welcome to come back. If. [00:58:55] Speaker A: If you're looking for the purest of flicks, Jake, for your next trilogy, I feel like we have at least a few on the docket. [00:59:00] Speaker C: I mean, I think I need to watch at least one movie where David A.R. white is pointing a gun at somebody. I think. I think that's what I really need in my life. [00:59:07] Speaker A: Got it. Yeah. David Ar. White, John Wick film. Sounds like something I never want and yet would watch it in instant. [00:59:14] Speaker B: God, can you imagine how flaccid it would be? [00:59:17] Speaker A: God, Jamie, look it up. [00:59:19] Speaker B: Jamie, pull that up. [00:59:20] Speaker A: Jamie, pull that up. Chat. [00:59:21] Speaker B: GPT generates great footage of David A.R. white in a John Wick film. [00:59:25] Speaker A: Yeah. Chad, GPT. What would Beckman 2 and Beckman 3 like, plot wise? [00:59:31] Speaker B: Well, what if Chad Stahelski directed Beckman too? [00:59:35] Speaker A: Yeah. What if. What if he wasn't forced by Lionsgate to do John Wick Chapter 5, John. [00:59:41] Speaker B: Wick in God We Trust. [00:59:45] Speaker A: But. Yeah. Jake, thank you so much for joining us again. [00:59:48] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, maybe next time. Maybe next time our spirits will be more lifted by the films we discussed. [00:59:54] Speaker A: Absolutely. I think just to really counteract the, the, you know, the bubblegum pop of the Gary Marshall trilogy and this film, you should find the sluttiest trilogy possible. Oh, horny, we'll get you On. [01:00:06] Speaker C: I've got a mission now. [01:00:08] Speaker A: And I will tell you now, there's. [01:00:09] Speaker B: Only two Horny Jake trilogy. [01:00:11] Speaker A: There's only two nymphomaniac films. So I need to settle down on that. [01:00:15] Speaker C: I don't think. Well, that's out. I'll have to. Yeah, I'll have to look around, look. [01:00:18] Speaker A: Around, poke around, poke around. Hey, I guess. I guess if we wanted to, we could have him on for it. I actually would love to watch him watch these films. But we could watch the director of Raw. [01:00:31] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:00:31] Speaker A: Their newest movie comes out, I think this year. Oh, Alpha, which is. It's about a girl in college who basically is being rumored to have contracted a mysterious illness, doesn't know what it is. [01:00:46] Speaker B: That's Julia Ducourno. [01:00:48] Speaker A: Yes. That was it. That was the type of. That was the. Those were the type of films especially. Is it Titan? How do you. [01:00:55] Speaker B: Titan Teton. That was the time where I think Horny Car movie. [01:00:59] Speaker A: Yeah. When we saw that movie in a theater of three and we were two of the three. Yeah. Where I probably was like, it's probably good that no one else in the friend group is here, but I think it would have been fun to have Jake watch this for sure. Because I remember. I mean, since we're. I remember when you and I watched the Neon Demon together. [01:01:17] Speaker C: Yeah. That was a blast. [01:01:18] Speaker A: That was a trip. That was so much fun. I remember both of us screaming. That was a good time. That's. That was a maybe. Yeah. If there's a refen trilogy you would like to do, that might be fun. [01:01:31] Speaker B: Okay. [01:01:32] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:01:32] Speaker C: I don't know what would be considered his rise. He actually fall. [01:01:35] Speaker A: He does have a trilogy, I think. I think. Is it Pusher? [01:01:40] Speaker B: Pusher trilogy. [01:01:41] Speaker A: Okay, maybe we'll do that. But yeah. I feel like it's. I don't want to. I don't want to keep constantly pushing on to you or you think you have to pick something that is religious or not at all. [01:01:53] Speaker C: Not at all. He came right off the dome. [01:01:55] Speaker A: It can be shitty. As long as it's a. Not a religious. Shitty. I guess something a little. [01:02:00] Speaker B: We're also not banning you from doing religious suggestions. If that is. [01:02:04] Speaker A: No. [01:02:05] Speaker C: Yeah. [01:02:06] Speaker A: Just saying. If you've always had a Tommy Wiseau trilogy in your pocket that we never heard about. [01:02:10] Speaker C: I don't know. Have we gotten to three Tommy. So movies. Because he's done. [01:02:14] Speaker B: We have best fiends. [01:02:15] Speaker A: Best fiends. Yeah. [01:02:17] Speaker B: Did he ever make Big Shark? [01:02:18] Speaker C: I think they came out. I haven't seen Big Shark. [01:02:20] Speaker A: I think they made Big Shark. [01:02:22] Speaker B: Okay, so we got that. Hey, that's something. That's something. [01:02:26] Speaker A: But, yeah. Again, Jake, thank you so much for joining us. Thank you guys for having me twice. [01:02:31] Speaker B: In the first half of the year. [01:02:32] Speaker A: Look at that. You are. You are an odd trilogy's fave. Just as much if you don't think you are because you feel like this is. You're picking curse films. [01:02:40] Speaker B: You. [01:02:40] Speaker A: You are certainly. This. This is. This is. This was a fun time. It was also fun the fact that, you know, again, Andy and I, when it comes to watching most films, we try to have the highest quality possible to watch this. So when you said you found a bargain bin dvd, physical dvd, you may. [01:02:57] Speaker B: Have heard heard on the microphone. He's holding it in his hands right now. There you go. [01:03:01] Speaker A: And. Cause again, it's asmr. Yeah. Because again, the thing is, is, you know, once we're done with this episode, we don't have to hold on to the film physically in any way, shape or form. Andy and I. Jake has. [01:03:12] Speaker C: I have to take this home with me. You have to live with this. [01:03:15] Speaker A: You have to look at your fiance and go, hey, this is a part of the wall. [01:03:18] Speaker C: This is going back in the catalog. [01:03:20] Speaker B: Yeah, this is. [01:03:22] Speaker A: It'll be up there with the other movies. [01:03:24] Speaker C: Just don't look at it. Well, I'm happy we gave Pure Flix more money on this one than we did with the Reynolds. And I feel like for all we invested in them, you know, it's fair. [01:03:32] Speaker A: How much did you spend on that? [01:03:34] Speaker C: I think it's like $15. [01:03:35] Speaker A: That is. Okay. Okay. All right. [01:03:38] Speaker C: I think that's what a DVD runs you in a store. [01:03:41] Speaker A: That's true. [01:03:42] Speaker C: In 2025. Yeah. [01:03:44] Speaker A: Gosh, how many Gundams could you buy with that? $15. Nothing, right? Maybe a leg. [01:03:48] Speaker B: Maybe one. [01:03:49] Speaker A: Maybe one. [01:03:49] Speaker B: The cheap one. [01:03:50] Speaker A: All right, all right, Andy, let's. Let's not beat around the bush. We now have gone through. It's our final episode of April. How are we kicking off, May? [01:03:59] Speaker B: Yeah, well, you know, hot off the heels of our. Of our hundredth trilogy episode with the Rise of Hess, we. We figured it was time to both treat and challenge ourselves with our 101st Trilogy episode. This is a movie that's been on or not a movie, a trilogy. That's kind of been on our short list pretty much since the dawn of the pod. It was one of our kind of. We were both the most interested in doing it, but at the same time, it was kind of one we knew would like be kind of a deep dive. And we, you know, need to, you know, store up our reserves for it and things like that. So we've kind of waited for a good moment. [01:04:44] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:04:44] Speaker B: Because this is a. This is a trilogy of cinema about cinema. It's a meta cinematic trilogy. In fact, it is a curated trilogy by yours truly of Charlie Kaufman's metacinema contributions. Charlie Kaufman being the acclaimed screenwriter and at times director who's been doing it since the 90s, maybe even the 80s. Frequent collaborator with Spike Jones. And yeah, he has three films. Well, most of his films could probably be stretched to being defined as meta cinema at some level or another. Meta cinema being kind of cinema that explores itself or explores the cinematic medium, explores storytelling, and kind of references its own structure and narrative and devices, how. [01:05:44] Speaker A: It affects the people involved. [01:05:46] Speaker B: Yeah. But Kaufman has three films that kind of deal with it the most explicitly and even at times kind of reference themselves as film productions within the structure of the story. And those three are 1999's Being John Malkovich, 2002's Adaptation, and 2008's Synecdoche, New. [01:06:11] Speaker A: York, which a lot of those films, I mean, are pretty much poster. Poster children for basically just, like, you know, the best of the best, you know, like. [01:06:25] Speaker B: Yeah. Of, like, heady movies and. Yeah, yeah. [01:06:28] Speaker A: Synthetici for specifically that. One of the three. [01:06:32] Speaker B: Yeah. Synecdoche is kind of a classic, like, film, bro. Movie like, oh, dude, have you seen this? Which I have not seen. Have you seen any of these three? [01:06:42] Speaker A: I haven't. I seen clips. There is a book that I think Jake and I both got in separate classes, but I think we both had to take it. You remember this, like, story by Robert McKee? Yeah, I am aware of Adaptation. Not just because there are two different Nicolas Cages in that. There's also a scene where I believe Succession's very own Brian Cox. [01:07:03] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:07:03] Speaker A: Great scene where he plays Robert McKee and just absolutely rails into Nicolas Cage's character. And I think that scene is, like, the big thing from Adaptation. John Malkovich is one where I think I've only seen the scene where it's just Malkovich playing every character, just saying Malkovich. [01:07:19] Speaker B: Right, right. [01:07:20] Speaker A: Which, to be honest, has nothing to do with anything we're talking about now. But I just watched Opus a few days back, and I just kind of want to watch some classic Malkovich because it was wild to see him in that movie and just be like, yeah, I don't know if I've seen a Malkovich film probably since I think. And it's not even recent, but, like, in terms of release. But burn after reading. [01:07:39] Speaker B: Yeah. Right. [01:07:40] Speaker A: We did burn after reading because he's. Oh, he's so funny. And Burn after reading. [01:07:44] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:07:45] Speaker A: And so it'll be fun to actually watch that film and talk about that. And then. Yeah. With Kiss and Deck, he also has the late, great Philip Seymour Hoffman. [01:07:53] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:07:54] Speaker A: So, yeah. And I. It also clarified, too, and I think I've brought it up before in past episodes, but, like, I am someone who, like, I have. Yeah. Very excited for this trilogy. And I'm super excited to see how your curation comes together when it talks about the idea of meta cinema with this. But I think I definitely wanted this to be the start of May because I feel like there were a lot of choices that were made earlier this year that if it wasn't for the fact that we had, like, certain guests or the fact that I'm like, come on, we gotta do something where it's like, we just, like. There were certain things where I, like, I wanted to be like, all right, let's do kind of one for us before we do, like, you know, I don't know. Well, at one point, we were going to do the Lilo and Stitch trilogy. But you were not. [01:08:37] Speaker B: I. I did put the Kai Bosh on there. [01:08:39] Speaker C: Oh, man. [01:08:40] Speaker A: Which is. It's not like we couldn't. We could always do in the future, but, like. Yeah, it was. It was one of those things where, like, we always try to, like, make sure, you know, we. If we do a lot what we think, like, you know, the audience really would enjoy us talking about more modern stuff or just, like, stuff that we think is silly and odd and maybe something that we wouldn't love. Good to put something. One for just us. [01:09:00] Speaker B: Yeah. One we can be personally excited about and journalistically excited about. [01:09:06] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. And it'll be exciting to finally watch all these three films and just go from literally go from the Jared Hess films to goss not dead 2. Now, talking about. [01:09:20] Speaker C: I hope this was a good palate cleanser. [01:09:22] Speaker A: Oh, absolutely. And, John, stop. Gap. It was funny. And, I mean, I will. I will not say, but I will tease that we also basically, I guess, have a palate cleanser to metacinema right after we do. So it's like, we like to balance it out in a fun way. [01:09:37] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:09:37] Speaker A: And to this, I think this would be a lot of fun because I think there's a good chance it'll be, like, a lot like the Wong Kar Wai episode where we really are just, like, invested in just the. The oddity of it being just like having a conversation about metacinema in. In three vastly different ways. Yeah, but, yeah, that, I believe, is May 10, when that episode is. [01:09:59] Speaker B: Yeah, that sounds right. [01:10:00] Speaker A: But, yeah, tune in on May 10th when we do Kaufman's Metacinema trilogy. But as always, I'm Logan Soosh. [01:10:07] Speaker B: And I'm Andy Carr. [01:10:08] Speaker A: Thank you so much for listening. Bye.